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lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:08 PM (GMT)
"Vlasi-zaboraven narod"
The "Wallachians" of Euboea

Mnogu cekav da se javat vlasite sami da zboruvaat za sebe, siguren sum deka gi ima na forumov, no se sramat od sebe, ne znam zosto, no ete resiv da pratam nesto malu za vlasite(ne znam zosto bas pocnav so ova?!), no se nadevam deka site ke doprinesete na temava , da poprajme malku muabet za VLASITE- nezamenlivi vo balkanskata komplicirana istorija. niz vekovite tie bile vazen del od Albanskiot, Grckiot, i slavjanskite(Srbi, Bugari, Makedonci, Crnogorci) narodi.
Se pretstavuvale kako site mnozinski narodi vo drzavite vo koi ziveele....i doprinele sekako za da Balkanskata KASA bide pobogata....

The quintessential Virginia Woolf, as captured by the camera from demi-profile.

Clad in silks like a high priestess, she had something of a Roman Vestal about her.
Virginia Woolf first visited Greece in 1906, only to have to wait 26 year for her second visit of 1932..Her travel notes, written on these occasions were titled 0n the Grand Tour I, Journal September-October 1906, and were re-edited recently by Jan Morris in her book Travels with Virginia Woolf - The Hogarth Press London 1993, a book which passed relatively unnoticed. Were it not for Woolf's unusual -albeit brief- encounter and kind description of Wallachian shepherds of the Eastern Greek province of Euboea, we ourselves, would have, most probably failed to notice it too.. What the ultra-refined literary Bloomsbury Diva is offering here is an utterly unusual (and of great value for an anthropologist) kind of gift: a description of what she calls "Wallachian shepherds"- a both delightful and intriguing surprise..As far as we are aware, this text -that ought to have been exposed- was up to this day ignored by the Greek research Czars..For unknown reasons, those who are credited with shedding light on this matter, paralysed maybe by a routine that is a sterile reflex of the political correctness, ignore not rarely the sort of evidence that might not suit their own narrow agenda..
We reproduce here Virginia Woolf's text that has to be related to the complex context of Greece year AD 1906: a land inhabited at that time by various and colourful ethnical groups.
Virginia and her party made a detour from the usual tourist route to visit the island of Evvoia (Euboea), where the Noel family had, since 1832, owned an estate called Achmetaga, at modern Prokopion..

"..We walked out down a lane to see an encampment of Wallachian shepherds...They are nomad people, tending sheep, who roam in the mountains all the summer, & pitch their tents, or rather their huts, in the winter..We were go inside their huts. They are made of boughs, & the dead leaves serve for lining to the roof. A family of twelve children lived here; brown and sallow, gentle & communicative. They shook hands - the women were weaving cloth, in an outer court; & inside was the sleeping place of the family. They live presumably in the open air; we peered around, & tried, not very successfully, to imagine the whole life, built on such a foundation. But this needs more imagination than any other feat of archaeology; for mud huts belong to the dark ages. The people did not look robust or fierce; one or two women had notably fine faces, aquiline and expressive. Then we tramped some way over the estate; & this would be a dull record, but all the time, somehow - I can't define it - you felt the place arrange itself in its natural order, & and this was something beautiful. Here were the olive groves - here they dug a trench - here come all the village people, trooping home from work with their salutations, prompt & respectful. Miss Noel knew each by name; each spoke to her. Now this seemed to give what was wanting to Greece before; & it is a very essential part of it. The people use the same plough that they did in the days of Homer, says Mr. Noel, & though the races have changed, their lives cannot be much different; the earth changes but little.."

Athens, 16 September 1906

It is worth quoting briefly here Virginia Woolf's description of Athens, and one can not escape the feeling that 16 September 1906 comes perilously close in time to James Joyce's own Ulysses Bloom's Day.. Woolf gives a realistic if slight elitist account of the Greek capital, a city having at that time a conspicuous Albanian presence:

"The poorer people of Athens - & all the people seem poor- have a pleasant habit of longing up here in the evening, when their work is done; just as we stroll in our parks. They sit about on classic marble, chatting & knitting; but they do not vulgarise the place as we Tourists must do; but rather make it human and familiar.
The people of Athens are, of course, no more Athenian than I am. They do not understand the Greek of the age of Pericles - when I speak it. Not are their features more classic than their speech: the Turk and the Albanian & Franks - it seems- have produced a common type enough. It is dark and dusky, small of stature, & not very well grown. It is true that the streets are dignified by the presence of many rustics, in their Albanian dress; the men wear thick white coats, kilts, much pleated; & long gaiters. But this you may see written in a dozen guide books. I have seen no native women; & indeed you see very few women. The streets are crowded with men drinking & smoking in the open air, even, in the country, sleeping beneath the wall; but the women keep within. You generally see them leading children, or looking from an upper window, where, presumably, they work. But the mind has no difficulty in making brigands."

"..Tribes of many different peoples.."

As it was fashionable at that time to embrace a re-discovered Byzantium and its fascinating ethnic-blend heritage, Virginia Woolf does not lose the opportunity, while still in Euboea and probably influenced by her "Wallachian encounter", to give her own version of an 1906 Greek heritage of multicultural and multiracial society..:<B

"Like a shifting layer of sand these loosely composed tribes of many different peoples lie across Greece; calling themselves Greek indeed, but bearing the same kind of relation to the old Greek that their tongue does to his. For the language they talk is divided from the language that few of them can write as widely as that again is divided from the speech of Plato. The spoken language because it has not been fixed by grammar or spelling, twists itself afresh on each tongue. The peasants drop syllables, & slur vowels so that as proficient a speaker as Miss Noel could not undertake to write down the words that run so swiftly from her tongue. Nor could she read or write the Greek of the newspapers; & still less could she read the Greek of the Classics. So you must look upon Modern Greek as an impure nation of peasants, just as you must look upon the modern Greek as a nation of mongrel element & a rustic beside the classic speech of pure bred races."

(Virginia Woolf on Greece - in "Travels with Virginia Woolf". Edited by Jan Morris - The Hogarth Press London 1993, pp. 208 - 213)


 Table of contents

RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod, lupus, 05-Mar-05, (1)
RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod, lupus, 05-Mar-05, (2)
RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod, lupus, 05-Mar-05, (3)
RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod, lupus, 05-Mar-05, (4)
RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod, lupus, 05-Mar-05, (5)
RE: Vlasite vo Ohrid, lupus, 05-Mar-05, (6)
RE: Vlasite nasi sosedi, lupus, 05-Mar-05, (7)
RE: Vlasite nasi sosedi, lupus, 05-Mar-05, (8)
RE: Vlasite vo Ohrid, Kain, 05-Mar-05, (10)
Vlasite se``gazdi``vo Makedonija!, ABC, 06-Mar-05, (11)
Me zacuduva, dijasporec, 06-Mar-05, (12)
RE: Vlasite se``gazdi``vo Makedonij..., Kain, 06-Mar-05, (13)
RE: Vlasite se``gazdi``vo Makedonij..., ABC, 06-Mar-05, (14)
Stvarno?, Kain, 06-Mar-05, (15)
RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!, lupus, 06-Mar-05, (16)
RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!, gropaj, 06-Mar-05, (17)
RE: Vlasite se SE vo Makedonija!, ABC, 07-Mar-05, (18)
RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!, lupus, 07-Mar-05, (19)
RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!, ABC, 11-Mar-05, (20)
RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!, lupus, 12-Mar-05, (21)
RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!, ABC, 12-Mar-05, (22)
RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod, iva, 06-Jun-05, (23)
RE: za IVA, lupus, 07-Jun-05, (25)

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lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:12 PM (GMT)
1. "RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod"
"Vlakhi or Vlahiotes"
Edward Lear toured Albania, Epirus, Macedonia and Thessaly in the spring-autumn of 1848. Accompanied by his Greek "Dragoman" -an interpreter who was proficient in ten languages- he explored the unknown and intriguing corners of -what was still then known as- "Turkey in Europe"..Back in London publishes this travel account titled "Journal of a Landscape Painter in Greece and Albania" together with twenty lithographs drawn by himself..The journey itself was still at that time a perilous one..he and his Greek "Dragoman" named Giorgio (who was also a cook and valet) are attacked by the ferocious mastiff dogs of the shepherds (with whom they put a fight: using a whip and guns while the shepherd is hitting back the travelers with an immense club ), brigands, the discomfort of the "locandas" (inns) , whims of the "khandji-s" (inn-keepers) and the omnipresent flies, mosquitoes and lices..While in Thessaly, Lear is encountering a herd of camels, this animal still being very much used as means of transport in the Greek provinces at 1848. Lear describes also the costumes and garb of the local people, women-folks wearing shalvari, veil covered faces, or the weaponry arsenal of men..Once in Salonica, he finds this city deserted due to the odd cholera epidemic while malaria prevails in Larissa..hence Lears's provisions of quinine. Europe of 1848 was the year of the Revolution, but its extreme corner, the Greek Peninsula, seem to be a world apart from the social and ideological turmoil.. In his foreword, Lear -a close friend and protégé of The 13th Earl of Derby- is warning those who wish to visit these lands:

"To the unlearnt tourist, indeed, Albania is a puzzle of the highest order. Whatever he may already known of ancient nomenclature- Epirus, Molossia, Thesprotia, etc.-is thwarted and confused by Turkish divisions and Pashaliks; beyond these, wheel within wheel, a third set of names distract him in shape of native tribes and districts - Tjamouria, Dibra, etc. And no sooner does he begin to understand the motley crowd which inhabits these provinces -Greeks, Slavonians, Albanians, Bulgarians, or Vlachi -than he is anew bewildered by a fresh list of distinctive sub-splitting, Liape, Mereditti, Khimariotes, and Toskidhes. races, religions, and national denominations seem so ill defined, or so entangled, that he would give up the perplexing study in despair were it not for the assistance of many excellent books already published on the subject. Of these, the works of Colonel Leake stand highest, as conveying by far the greatest mass of minutely accurate information regarding these magnificent and interesting countries"..

We start these short sequences of quotes from Lear's text with a description of Metsovo where he stayed for two days..Previously, he is mentioning a certain Zacaria "a Vlach priest of Khimara or Himare" who kept him company for a while:

"Metzovo is inhabited by Vlakhi or Vlakhiotes - a people of Wallachian descent, already spoken of in these journals as occupying portions of Albania. In general their employment is that of shepherds, and as such they move about with their flocks from district to district. But in certain parts of the mountains settled colonies of them exist, who posses large flocks of sheep and goats, and are distinguished for their industrious and quiet habits of life..Many of the men emigrate as laborers, artisans, etc., to Germany, Hungary, Russia, etc., and return only in summer to their families. They retain their language (..)There is much that is interesting and pleasant in this elevated town (i.e. Metsovo). The houses stand mostly detached among gardens, rocks, beech and ilex trees, and a thousand pictures of pastoral mountain life might be chosen, though the general scenery is of too large a character for the pencil. The people also seem simple and sociable in manners: while I am drawing they bring me bunches of narcissus and cowslips and endeavor to converse. All have a robust and healthful appearance, very different to the people in plain..

At half past six I begin to ascend towards the highest ridge of the Metsovo pass, called the Zygos, a formidable journey when there is high wind or snow. (..) Few mountain passes are finer in character than this part of the Pindus range."

Trikala, 20th of May, 1848

We halted at midday in a cafe of Trikala, the keeper of which was a man of Trieste, who talked of quela Londra, e quel Parigi' with the air of a man of travel. But the sort of mongrel appearance of every person and thing in the town is not pleasing to the eye of an artist who has been wandering much among real costumes and Eastern characteristic. Blue-tailed coats worn over Albanian fustannelles, white fleecy capotes above trousers and boots, are doubtless innocent absurdities, but they are ugly.
At half past three we again proceeded. The town of Trikalla is large, but greatly neglected, and partly in ruins; nevertheless, the bazaars seem extensive and bustling...

The Camels of Thessaly
While departing the town of Larissa to check the mountainous scenery of Ossa and Olympus, Lear and his companion are encountering a pack of nervous camels, who prove to pose a danger to their horses...Finally, Lear and his companion escape while chose to run away from the enraged camels..

"In some meadows near a little stream flowing into the Peneus were several camels, which are frequently used about Salonica and Katerina, etc. They were ragged and hideous creatures, and offered a great contrast to the trim and well-kept animals of our Arabs, which we had so familiarly known in our journey through the desert of Suez and Sinai. But as I returned towards Tempe I perceived a young one among the herd, and I rode a little way towards it despite of the clamorous entreaties of the Yannina muleteer. I had better have attended to his remonstrances, for the little animal (who resembled nothing so much as a large white muff upon stilts), chose to rush towards us with the most cheerful and innocent intentions, and skipping and jumping after the fashion of delighted kids, thrust himself into the way of three horses with the most facetious perverseness. One and all took fright, and the muleteer's reared, threw him and escaped. There was much difficulty in recapturing the terrified animal, and when we had done so forth came the little muffy white beast once more, pursuing us with the most profuse antics over the plain and rendering our steeds perfectly unmanageable. To add to our discomfiture, the whole herd of camels, disapproving of the distance to which we were inveigling their young relation, began to follow us with an increasingly quick trot ; and we were too glad to ford the stream as quickly as possible and leave our gaunt pursuers and their foolish offsprings on the opposite side."

Salonica: miasma of cholera
It is September 12th, year 1848 when Lear lands in Salonica after a journey from Constantinopole embarked on Austrian steamer. He describes the human freight as "the packed Wallachians and Bosniacs and Jews who stared crampfully from the deck and disentangled themselves into numerous boats"..Once into Salonica, they enter a place haunted by a bout of cholera epidemic. Below is Lear's description of Salonica, a city which he characterizes as "inhabited by a very great proportion of Jews.." :

"Whatever the past of Salonica, its present seems gloomy enough. The woe, the dolefulness of this city! - its narrow, ill-paved streets (evil awaits the man who tries to walk with nailed boots on the rounded slippery stones of a Turkish pavement!); the very few people I met in them carefully avoiding contact; the closed houses; the ominous silence; the sultry, oppressive heat of the day; all contributed to impress the mind with a feeling of heavy melancholy. A few Jews in dark dresses and turbans; Jewesses, their hair tied up in long, caterpillar-like green silk bags, three feet in length; Greek porters, aged Blacks, of whom-freed slaves from Stamboul-there are many in Salonica ; these were the only human beings I encountered in threading a labyrinth of lanes in the lower town, ascending towards the upper part of this formerly extensive city. Once, a bier with a corpse on it, borne by some six or eight of the most wretched creatures, crossed my path ; and when I arrived at the beautiful ruin called the Incantada two women, I was told, had just expired within the courtyard, and, said the ghastly-looking Greek on the threshold, 'You may come and examine what you please, and welcome; but once you are in quarantine, and may not go out', an invitation I declined as politely as I could and I passed onward. From the convent at the summit of the town, just within its walls, the view should be most glorious, as one ought to see the whole of the gulf and all range of Olympus; but alas! beyond the silvery minarets relieving the monotonous surface of roofs below and the delicately indented shore and the blue gulf, all else was blotted out, as it were, by a curtain of hot purple haze, telling tales of my fancy miasma and cholera, fever and death."


lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:27 PM (GMT)
2. "RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod"

Se izvinuvam sto ete taka samo copy-paste-iram, bez komentari, no toa go pravam za da vi obrnam vnimanie na site, kolku raboti ne se znaat za eden mnogu vazen narod balkanski kako vlaskiot, a nie celo vreme drndame za balkanska istorija i balkanski narodi.....

A recollection of the Romanian schools of Macedonia, Epirus and Albania

The first Romanian school established :
Location: Tarnova (today FYR Macedonia)
year of founding: 1864
Functions on a regular basis since 1867
type: boys school
Teachers: Dimitrie Atanasescu (a native of Tarnova)
Number of pupils as registered in the school year 1888-89: 20 pupils
Names of the pupils year 1889-90:

Cocia Hr. Cotta
Cusu Natu
Ghiusu C. Natu
Petru Thimiu Cuciuchi
Sachi G. Saragiu
Tachi M. Saragiu
Tirciu Dzodzi
George P.G. Grecu
George D. Belcameniootu
Nida Hr. Cotta
Petru Z.G. Caranicu
Pandu M. Terpin
Vangheliu D. Atanasescu
Lachiu Nachi Duca
Stavre N. Slobacu
Tudorachi Hr. Cotta
Gusu G. Buze
Nicolachii D. Atanasescu
Steriu C.T. Belcameniotu

The second established Romanian school:
location: Gopesi (Gopesh) - (today FYR Macedonia)
year of founding: 1867
type: boys school
Teachers: Dimitrie Cosmescu (a native of Gopesi), Sterie Cionescu-Ciona, Nicolae Cosmescu, Gusu Nijopoleanu, Ghica Papa, D. Pilita, Gheorge Caracotta, Gorciu Tale
Number of the pupils as registered in the school year 1889-1890: 117
Names of the pupils year 1889-90:

Nicolae Dimca
Vangheli Mazni
George Musturicu
Demetriu Belciu
Nicolae Petrescu
Teodor Torbu
Papa-Gheorghe Anastasi
Levu Ioan
Toma Mihi
Vangheli Pricu
Demetru Biju
George Lerca
Alexandru Cuju
Teodor Musturic
Mihu Pachionu
Hristu Padori
Ioan Tecu
Demetru Ghiricociu
George N. Belciu
Michail Nita
Toma Constantin
Alexandru Cosca
Vangheli Papa Levu
George Hotu
Hristu Belciu
Ioan Papa-Goga
Alexandru Torbu
Nicolae Demetrescu
Ioan Bandu
Ioan Traian
Vangheli Belciu
Anastasi Coci Craja
Ioan Dimasu
Constantin Dunca
Nicolae Dica
Tiju Hristu
Steriu Lerca
Demetru Mihutan
Constantin Musturic
George Papa-Coci
Demetru Papa-Goga
George Papa Levu
Demetru Sotiri
Ioan Iotu
Constantin Iotu
Hristu Nanci
Demetru Carajea
Vangheli Nasi
George Pitca
Anastasi Protueru
Teodor Dienescu
Anastasi Franga
George Belciu
Teodoru Mazni
Nicolae Nata
Constantin Spau
Nicolae Zagana
George Pitu
Demetru Lerca
Nicolae Tuta
Teodor Lerca
Demetru Stefu
Demetru Dimeca
Vangheli Dociu Carajea
George Traian
Demetru Marci
Naum Bela
Sotir Padori
Gligori Robi
Hristu Mazni
Nicolae Sboti
Constantin Dimitrescu
Vangheli Carajea
Torbu Naum
Demetru Belciu
Alexandru Petrescu
Demetru Taci
Mihail Suban
Ioan Boiagi
Teodor Rambi
Ioan Sotiri
Ioan Coci Carajea
Dimca Demetru
Nicolae Cusi
Ioan Cota Cuzman
Constantin Dotti
Anastas Niciu
Constantin Stefa
George Spau
Teodor Papa Naum
Vangheli Ghiricociu
Vangheli Papa Dori
Demetru Necui
Nicolae Robi
Demetri Stefu
Anastasi Iuvani
George Coci Craja
George Romu
Anastas Ghiricociu
Mitu Maciu
Vangheliu Fani
Pitu Santa
Ilie Terpci

: mixed
Teachers: Apostol Margarit, Ioan Somu Tomescu, G. Dautti, Papa Ioan Tofechi, Tuliu Mihali
Number of registred pupils school year 1889-90: 60-90 pupils
Name of the pupils year 1889-90:

The fifth established Romanian school:
Location: Ochrida (today FYR Macedonia)
Year of founding: 1868
type: boys school
Teachers: G. Tomara, Gheorge Pihion, Filip Apostolescu, Ioan Zgala
Numbers of pupils as registered in year 1889-90: 55
Names of the pupils year 1889-90:

Achilea Dafina
Costi Busaca
Constantin Bumba
Dule Gepar
Gheorghe Chita
Mihali Joma
Mihali Stefanescu
Mihali Ionescu
Miha Ioan
Mitra Tamina
Nacu Deala
Pandi Miha
Pitu Sambitel
Spiru Joma
Sotir Ionescu
Tachi Busaca
Tascu Atanasescu
Tascu Stoe
Vangeliu Poa
Zisu Parmachi
Anton Petrescu
Bana Tamina
Iancu Baliuc
Ilia Pitosu
Mihali Ianecu
Niculae Ghiscu
Nicolae Murghila
Nicolae Constantinescu
Naum Atanasescu
Stefan Ghergu
Spiru Niculescu
Tomu Chiohi
Tachi Ionescu
Nicolae Ianescu
Zizi Sacarecu
Alexandru Gerah
Aureliu Goju
Gavriil Petrescu
Leon Papa Stefan
Naum Anastasescu
Pascu Veroniu
Spiru Dimonia
Spiru Baliuc
Tascu Ruvina
Tascu Arsen
Vangeliu Gepar
Atatasie Rusaca
Andrea Pihion
Stavri Bija
Tascu Goju
Vasilie Sacu
Dimitrie Naumescu
Dimitrie Verusu
Gregoriu Veroniu
Virgiliu Apostolescu

The seventh established Romanian school:
Location: Crusova (today in FYR of Macedonia)
type of the school: mixed
Year of founding: 1868
Teachers: Sterie Cionescu-Ciona, Vanghele Petrescu, Tascu Iliescu, Ion Unca, Papa Sterescu
Numbers of pupils as registered in year 1899-90: 133 boys and 20 girls
Names of the pupils year 1889-90:

Gheorghe Naidu
Vangheliu N. Petrasincu
Gheorghi S. Chiale
Teghia Cola
Aurel D. Papa Sterescu
Gheorghi S. Buracu
Halciu Tirciu
Ghiusu D. Papa Sterescu
Costu M. Nane
Mitu Terpce
Tachiu T. Chiale
Theghiu T. Chiale
Teghiu T. Ghiorghi
Nachiu Cola
Miha Dinu
Petra Anton
Ana N. Boiagi
Sunda Naidu
Unciu Anton
Iosif Tirciu
Ilciu Traian
Spiro Petre
Vasil Tascu
Miha Matheu
Costu Mihali
Vasile Gheorghi
Toma Unciu
Traian Petre
Gligor Cola
Vasili Ghiore
Miha G. Ciripar
Anton T. Dinischiot
Toma Petru
Gachiu S. Tiriviri
Costu T. Sunda
Vanciu C. Hassan
Teohari Buracu
Romul G. Bongu
Sula I. Chiale
Nata N. Logi
Costu Curte
Lachiu Cota
Costa Cocu
Nachi Cozaru
Stavre Degatace
Miha Gunusaru
Tascu Busa
Nascu Nicea
Costu Poat
Anton Petrasincu
Gorciu Levra
Todu Stabechi
Riste Traian
Vanciu Vretu
Domenic Unca
Nascu Dimitri
Mitu Mastur
Vana Baliu
Sotiri Blaje
Stoian Bote
Tachu Boiagi
Taciu Copaciu
Vasili Cacimaru
Vasili Ciriviri
Lachiu Demiri
Steriu Iotu
Unciu Leazi
Tascu Lefandi
Gheorghi Mucitane
Vana Nescu
Sotiri Naidu
Lachi Pure
Nachiu Stabechiu
Dimitri G. Giagiu
Lachiu Copaciu
Todu Domca
Toma Caracosta
Gheorgi Misiu
Steriu Nicia
Vanciu Ilio
Nachiu Mara
Chiriu Nedan
Gheorghi Domca
Lachiu Iana
Todu Pure
Lachiu Guchia
Giogiu Marcus
Costu Curte
Costu Ciusea
Pandu Cajea
Nachiu Curte
Sula Tana
Lachiu Cajea
Vasili Marcusu
Costu Cristu
Caciu Pure
Costu Iovan
Vasili Ida
Costu Mastur
Chiriu Dame
Nicolachi Ciulac
Nichiu Chiragi
Lezu Ghiatru
Ghicor Marcus
Cola Ciaciapina
Nascu Mane
Donciu Marcus
Chiriu Nascu
Gheorghi Leasca
Mateu Gherasi
Mihail Zissi
Nicolae C. Besca
Sergiu C. Petrasincu
Nicola C. Culuchita
Tascu Chiale
Vanciu G. Paliu
Vasili Cola
Christu Lozi
Lachiu T. Sunda
Petra Nedan
Todu Unca
Costu Buto
Demetriu S. Sunda
Demetriu Ciumca
Michail Diciacu
Nicolae Cornetescu-Cornetti
Tascu Cornetescu
Rafael Dinischiot
Matheu Siope
Frosa Curte
Tullia Mara
Victoria Ghiatru
Fania Ghiatru
Sevasta Bidini
Nusca Bidini
Lefta Cajea
Nusca Siope
Letta Bijia
Chia Pure
Domca Dima
Zugrafa Ito
Magdalina Presi
Opa Pure
Domca Curte
Lifca Curte

The tenth Romanian established school: Location: Perlepe - Prilep (FYR Macedonia)
Year of founding: 1878
Type of school: mixed
Teachers: D. Niculescu, I. Hondrozom, Dimitrie Lazarescu-Lecanta, Iordan Nica, N. Maracine
Number of pupils registered year 1889-90: 54
Names of the pupils year 1889-90:

Magiar Dimitrache
Mihailescu Petre
Argintar Alexandru
Bade Danail
Mitescu Iordan
Lanco Nicolae
Bidin Toma
Galeo Sergiu
Ghioca Gligore
Pletvareti Petre
Capidan Aspasia
Ciucur Tatia
Capidan Elena
Magiar Pandeli
Niculescu Taciu
Niculescu Petrache
Camberita Taciu
Pendifianga Pericle
Bidin Mihai
Plociar Costache
Petrescu Vlademir
Petrescu Magdalena
Ionescu Milan
Lazef Spiro
Vartan Haralambu
Lanco Niculae
Magiar Penelopa
Mitescu Vanciu
Ionescu Vasilichia
Magiar Bizanta
Gura-mica Vasilichia
Petrescu Maritza
Camberita Toma
Lanco Mance
Vartan Iordan
Giamo Stavrache
Gura-mica Petre
Cule Demetru
Capsali Dumitrache
Robescu Victoria
Pendifranga Magdalena
Slabeico Sofia
Capidan Tatia
Bidiu George
Vehe Vasile
Gligore Argintar
Lazef Hristu
Ghiuro Ionel
Constantinescu Hristu
Sapce Haralambie
Nica Sevasta
Constante Costa
Galeo George

The eleventh Romanian established school:
Location: Monastir - Bitule (today Bitolia in FYR Macedonia)
Year of founding: 1878
Type of the school: primary boys
Teachers: N. Popillian, P. Fundu, Lazu Dumi, G. Perdichi, Gh. Ghica-Papa
Numbers of pupils as registered in year 1888-89: 40
Names of the pupils year 1888-89:

Constantin Chiristigi
Stefan Constantin
Pandu Sunda
Vangheli Demetru
Mihail Tascu
Anastasi Mihail
Teodor Iona
Tache Eftimiu
Angheli Velo
Pandeli Chiurci
Alexi Cipu
Naum Sunda
Hristu Cipi
Teodor Nicola
Iancu Constantin
Leca Sunda
Petrusi Teodor
Mihail Sichirgi
Anton Milciu
Nicola D. Hangi
Geporge Buracu
Teodor Velu
Costachi Nicola
Traian Perdichi
Tachi Vlahu
Toma Fundu
Ghiusu Fundu
Nicolae Barzacu
Ioan Miclescu
Nacu Tale
Zisi Peta
Tachi Leasca
Toma Mihailescu
Ioan Ciomu
Tachi Sunda
Anastasie Comu
Petrachi Magiari
Petrachi Catergari
Tachi Naum
Demetre Hagi-Anton

The twelfth Romanian established school:
Location: Moloviste (today FYR Macedonia)
Year of founding: 1880
Type of school: boys
Teachers: Gusu Papa-Costa, Spiru Popescu, M. Dimonia

Number of pupils as registered in year 1888-89: 93
Names of the pupils year 1888-89:

Batalia Mihail
Batalia George
Bile Tascu
Barju Dimitrie
Damciu Stefan
Dosta Tascu
Bambula Petru
Cusca Vangheli
Cusca George
Ciapra Hristu
Ciapra Vangheli
Danciu Simion
Dunda Simion
Dunda Nicolae
Goli Tascu
Ghianciu Spiridon
Hagi-Marcu Ioan
Traicu Ioan
Topa Naum
Romce Ioan
Roata Trifon
Rizu Nicolae
Simce Nicolae
Stoian Grigoriu
Soptia Tascu
Tasicale Tascu
Zoghe Tascu
Anghele Alexa
Bele Dimitrie
Bele George
Balgia Spiridon
Cerla Leonida
Cioada Stefan
Cusca Teodor
Dunda Constantin
Dame Spiridon
Dina Ioan
Franga Tascu
Licusa Stavre
Naunca Sotir
Olde Spiridon
Papa-Simu Teodor
Fundira Constantin
Maciu Lazar
Macavea Dimitrie
Nestor Mihail
Nanca Nicolae
Rizu Tascu
Anghele Nicolae
Cuca Constantin
Chitan Lambru
Cociu Spiridon
Tasicale Nicolae
Busicu Hristu
Bogu Steriu
Ciomu Consatntin
Ciomu Hristu
Cusac Vangheli
Goli Steriu
Hagi-Marcu George
Maciu George
Percea Vangheli
Papa-Costea Hristu
Paligora Ioan
Trista Vangheli
Ciomu Tascu
Ciomu Ioan
Cusca Pandeli
Cusca Stefan
Marti Constantin
Chiamo Dimitrie
Ciumandra Spiridon
Curanda Constantin
Gole Anton
Ilia Simion
Cerla Mihail
Meta Teodor
Paligora Stefan
Tigarida George
Papa-Costa Tascu
Poscu Dimitrie
Simcea Constantin
Terpu Constantin
Velo Nicolae
Vulcan George
Barda Tascu
Peca George
Mischia Dimitrie
Mufa Hristu
Paze Nicolae
Papa-Tarpu Ioan
Peca Constantin

The fourteenth established Romanian school:
Location: Magarova (today in FYR Macedonia)
Year of founding: 1880, September
Type of school: boys
Number of pupils as registered year 1888-89: 47
Names of the pupils year 1888-89:

Tachi Stoice
Tascu Ghica
Pandu Vacar
Toda Vosiale
Tascu Gopisianu
Petru Lazarescu
Toma Alexu
Petru Chiria
Costi Colciu-Cara
Vangheli Naum-Tete
Tanasachi Petre
Miha Cole
Petre I. Terpa
Giamu Cociu
Marcu Cociu
Cocea Gopisan
Ciamita Butcaru
Pandu Softa
Bogdan Gioga
Tascu Samara
Gheca Nasi Morena
Dusu Dafin
Tanasachi I. Terpa
Nicolachi Schipitaru
Toma N. Caciun
Peter Ionescu
Nida Ciapan
Tusu Caramin
Unca Caramin
Gusu Casidi
Tachi Mihailescu
Toma Gheci
Pandu Rusachi
Vancu Mira
Tachi Tusu-Tega
Sotiri Bije
Coicea Rusdachi
Tachi Hrisicu
Tascu Petre
Dinu Mane
Costi D. Dova
Petre Eftimescu
Gogu Mina
Tachi Dafin
Hristu Tete
Nachi Dinu
Cocea Pavle

The nineteenth Romanian school established:
Location: Monastir - Bitolia (Bitule) (today FYR Macedonia)
Year of founding: 1880, March
Type: Lyceum (seven years term):
Name of the teachers: V. Glodariu, R. Corvin, Ioan Gheorghiade, Mrs. Gheorghiade (religion), C. Caieretti (mathematics), Agop Artinian (Turkish language), V. Petrescu (drawing and caligraphy), N. Maimuca (French language), I. Ciulli (mathematics, accounting), H. Pavliu (geography), Vangheli Petrescu (French language), D. Cosmoileiu (Head Master, also teaching Romanian and German languages), Father Faveyrial (philosophy and French), A. Stefanescu-Gudela (mathematics), N. Maimuca (chemistry, biology and natural sciences), G. Dautti (Latin language), I. Ciulli (religion and mathematics), M. Baliu (natural sciences), N. Craia (History, geography and Italian languages), Iusuf Efendi (Turkish language), Tache A. Margarit (French, 3rd and 4th classes), Gusu Sarmachesi (1st and 2nd classes), T.Sunda (tutor and pedagogue), D. Lazu-Dumi (pedagogue)
Numbers of the pupils as registered year 1888-89: Gymnasium: 70; Lyceum: 95 of whom interns 65
Numbers of pupils who receive stipendiums: 46
Names of the pupils year 1889-90:

Ioan Ciumetti
George Badralexi
Gusa Cionga
George Cica
Alexi Parjita
Stefan Velu
Teodor Nero
Apostolescu Hariton
Christu Birislav
Naum Moco
Sterie Dinischiot
George Carastam
Costa Ciara
Nicolae George
Constantin Chioca
Teodor Dimca
Demetriu Tono
Alexandru Cristoforidi
Iona Ghiulamila
Adam Coe
Harambi Coe
Nicolae Batzaria
Constantin Cille
Pericle Papa-Hagi
Gusu Apostolescu
Baracu Ioan
Nusi Tulliu
Ioan N. Papa-Hagi
Ilie Papa-Hagi
Nicolae Caracotta
Nicolae Dimonie
Eftimie Dafina
Satvre Buhia
Filip Misa
Constantin Meta
Tascu Purcarea
Vasilie Dimonic
Tachi Perdichi
Ercule Papa-George
Cusu Perdichi
Vangheli Narte
Ioan Papinian
Sterie Perdichi
Teodor Narte
Leon Constantinescu
Ioan Ciomu
Demetriu Pitza
Ioan Papa-Hagi
Ioan P. Hagi
Nicolae Cianta
Ioan Coian
Lazar Atanasscu
Nicolae Tacit
Ilie Ghicu
George Zverca
Pavel Hagi-Joga
Tuliu Mihail
Sterie Ciumetti
Ioan Argintin
Mihail Statu
Atanasi Papa-Ioan
George Cionga
Pericli Civica
Simu Berberi
Ion Dalametra

The twentieth Romanian established school:
Location: Nijopole (today FYR Macedonia)
Year of founding: 1881
Type of school: mixed
Names of the teachers: Gusu Nijopoleanu, D. Zugraf, Z. Papazi

Number of pupils as registered in year 1888-890
Names of pupils year 1888-89:

Stavre Spiru
Toda Steriu
Vasile Dimce
Goga Letzu
Tonca Ferfeli
Gusu Cutumina
Demetru Caracotta
Mihu Bechi
Tascu Bitaracu
Simon Petru
Petru Ferfeli
Teodor Ferfeli
Toda Placiu
Sidu Nijopolean
Petru Barba
Santa Caracotta
Santa Memtza
Natalia Spiru
Sana Calivianu
Nicolae Papazi
Mihu Sebe
Sotira Nicolae
Ioan Cota
Cocia Pariscu
Donca George
Goga Zugraf
Tascu Demetru
Dinu George
Giogea Zisi
Nicolae Anghelescu
Zoita Chendemen
Nicolae Baruta
Nacu Papazi
Hrista Anghelescu
Nicolae Mile
Cocia Hutza
Cocia Caracota
Sotiria Bitaracu
Goga Bechi
Banu Chendimen
Teodor Liacu
Naum Temelcu
Teodor Ferfeli
George Ferfeli
Ceorge Curculuchi
Cocia Ioan
Luisa Demetru
Petru Mihali
Mia Caracotta
Nacu Marcu
Tascu Statu
Mihali Spiru
Cocea Palea
Cocea Apostolescu

Cocea Gherza
Nicolae Ghioca
Teodor Bitaracu
Nida Bechi
Gusu Nita
Fusu Vreta
Cocia Zugraf
Teodor Curculuchi
Halciu Memta
Tascu Calivianu
Gusu Bechi
Iona Bitaracu
Nacea Barbu
Tachi Sebe
Teodor Marcu

The twenty sixth Romanian school opened:
Location: Resna today FYR Macedonia
Year of founding: 1889
type of school: boys
Names of the teacher: P. Fundu
Number of pupils: n/a
Names of the pupils: n/a

The village of Avdela (Avdhela) in the depths of the Pindus mountains, to this very day one of the strongholds of the pro-Romanian Vlachs. It was burnt to the ground in June 1906 by the Greek andartes who tried thus in vain to convert its inhabitants to "Hellenism".

Avdela was the birthplace of such personalities as Apostol Margarit, Manaki Brothes (photographers of the Romanian Royal Court), Nushi Tulliu (inspector of the Romanian schools in Macedonia, journalist and author of repute), Tache Papahagi (of Romanian Academy, the author of the massive "Dictionary of the Aromanian Dialect"), the Tambozzi family (whose members such as Justin Tambozzi is a Senator in the Romanian Parliament while others remarked themselves as scientists in America) and many others..

(photo courtesy Kings College London)

* * * * *

The first Romanian Girls school established:
Location: Ochrida today FYR Macedonia
Year of founding: 1879, January
Type of school: Girls
Teachers: Agatia Apostolescu, Fani Petru
Numbers of pupils year 1889-90: 20
Names of the girls year 1889-90:

Anastasia Biba
Calina Verus
Lenca Gerahu
Lenca Veroniu
Marita Apostolescu
Marita Traice
Nusca Dimonie
Nusca Dafa
Nusca Stoe
Polixenia Scuretta
Polixenia Veroniu
Clio Tote
Morfa Dimonie
Marita Coe
Marita Picina
Sandra Pendu
Vasa Nestoru
Victoria Veroniu
Calina Roca
Zaha Coe

The second Romanian Girls school established:
Location: Crusova today in FYR Macedonia
Year of founding: 1879, September
Type of school: girls
Names of the teachers: Victoria Petrescu, Sevastia Coloveloni, Zaha Iotu (nee Gruia), Constantina Curti, Zaharia Busa (Head Master)
Number of pupils as registered year 1889-90: 87 girls
Names of the girls year 1888-90:

Clasa incepatoare:

Anasatsia Cornetescu
Calliopa Chiale
Calliopa Chiurciu
Athina Dimitrie
Calliopa Naumescu
Chiacusa Dogu
Costa Pure
Domnica Dimitri
Elisabeta Matlacuca
Elisabeta Pure
Elisabeta Sterie
Eufrosina Balliu
Eufrosina Pure
Fania Chiose
Fania Moche
Fancia Marinca
Flora Nisca
Flora Sunda
Florica Tiriviri
Zisca Petrasincu
Cleanta Leapu
Vasilichia Zegataci
Hariclia Gogu
Florica Unca
Hariclia Leasca
Mahe Berberi
Magdalena Leasca
Magdalena Pota
Marioara Lesca
Nusca Pure
Nichia Besca
Nichia Busa
Lesca Chiurciu
Vasilichia Moche
Vasilichia Prenda
Vasilichia Tiriviri
Victoria Svolu
Vasca Bojini
Zaharia Moche
Zaharia Blaje
Vasilichia Topuzi
Tuca Petrasincu
Bucica Cornetescu
Elisabeta Tomu
Eufrosina Unca
Lenca Zegataci
Zisa Buca
Tallia Petrasincu
Nifca Cole
Virghilia Cornetescu
Pasca Bereberu
Caliopa Leapu
Antigonia Ghiutza
Dulcina Colochita
Hariclia Prenda
Nusca Odi
Magdalena Leasca
Hariclia Mitu
Domnica Nane
Fanca Liazi
Victoria Chiale
Tallia Moiche
Domnica Gopisian
Posa Sunda
Fania Moche
Magdalena Leasca
Hariclia Chiale
Nusca Cheale
Nusca Gabeli
Nusca Iani
Victoria Cornetescu
Victoria Lozi
Victoria Naumescu
Sevastia Pota
Zisca Comatti
Magdalena Blaje
Magdalena Cornetescu
Maria Topuzi
Polixenia Gheorghiu
Anastasia Cacardacu
Domnica Ioan
Fania Caciumani
Florica Cheale
Fania Glavina
Hariclia Leasca
Magdalena Petrasincu
Nita Dinischioti

The third Romanian Girls school established:
Location: Gopesi today FYR Macedonia
Year of founding: November 1879
Names of the teachers: Elisa Petrescu, Venera Chircu, Vasilichia Plaicu
Number of pupils as registered year 1888-89: 41
Names of the girls year 1888-89

Maria Carajea
Venera Tingra
Stefana Muzi
Stefana Cicotti
Vasilichia Mihi
Alezandrina Torbu
Domnica Mazni
Libertatea Muzi
Sofia Pitca
Zacharia Dimuza
Constantina Santi
Venera Cociu Sterghiu
Stefana Sbotti
Stefana Papa-Goga
Domnica Tola
Stefana Fijiu
Eugenia Neciu
Alexandrina Naciu
Vasilichia Ghiricoiu
Domnica Pitza
Stefana Belciu
Stefana Mihutani
Alexandrina Paciu
Carajea Domnica
Alexandrina Romul
Elena Belciu
Stefana Dapu
Constantina Carajea
Vasilichia Natu
Stefana Sbotti
Ecatherina Torbu
Stefana Papa-Cociu
Vsilichia Fani
Vangelitza Dotti
Stefana Ducarita
Vanghelita Fani
Subani Constantina
Sofia Buhu
Vasilica Hrissicu
Elena Stefa
Stefana Subani
Domnica Sbotti

The fifth Romanian Girls school open:
Location: Bitolia-Monastir today FYR Macedonia
Names of the teachers: Alexandrina Bizanti, Smaranda Diculescu, Sevastia Coloveloni, Eudochia Dumi (nee Dimitriu), Victoria Teohari
Number of pupils as registered year 1889-90: 63
Names of the girls year 1889-90:

Elena Tascu
Vasilichia Naum
Eftimescu Atina
Sol Iacob
Melpomeni Tale
Evantia Marcu
Malca Ianton
Sofia Simion
Siniora Buhor
Elena Steriu
Stel Refel
Fania Muja
Andromahi Maza
Sevastia Gheorghe
Maria Tale
Sehule Ianton
Aspasia Spase
Maria Timiu
Hana Iuda
Rondus Spase
Fania Ioan
Mariam Sacuciu
Eugenia Anghel
Hrisanta Mihail
Elena Alexi
Manda Binecu
Maria Simion
Reina Refel
Strela Muson
Maria Anton
Matia Buracu
Atina Binecu
Paraschiva Constantin
Agnia Eftimescu
Paraschiva Naum
Calliopa Tascu
Binecu Maria
Ecaterina Constantin
Atina Mihail
Olga Ioan
Athina Thimiu
Maria Masi
Victoria Nicolau
Emilia Ianchi
Aspasia Muja
Atina Plastaru
Lili Buhor
Pandora Ioan
Muson Mato
Elisavet Sunda
Maria Gheorghe
Elena Gheorghe
Fania Stavru
Santa Costi
Maria Ioan
Polixenia Marcu
Mato Mercado
Maria Perdichi
Victoria Petru
Civiva Sultana I
Civica Sultana II
Evanthia Ceapara
Elena Costi
Sofia Ionescu
Vasilichia Ionescu
Athina Naum
Fania Petra
Fania Steriu
Andronica Todi
Eudochia Tonu

The sixths Romanian girls school established:
Location: Molovistea today FYR Macedonia
Year of founding: 1881
Names of the teachers: Fania G. Papa-Costa (nee Tono)
Number of pupils year 1889-90: 49
Names of the girls year 1889-90

Constantina Bijiu
Fania S. Buza
Elisabeta S. Buseicu
Santa T. Buseicu
Zaharia Ciumandra
Constantina N. Goli
Victoria F. Nace
Constantina N. Rize
Paraschevia G. Save
Elisabeta S. Percea
Zaharia N. Batalia
Victoria T. Barju
Fania C. Biju
Santa M. Craia
Hariclia D. Liascu
Paraschevia D. Meta
Vasilichia F. Nace
Vasilishia Papa Terpu
Elena C. Paligora
Zaharia C. Paligora
Santa C. Paligora
Vasilichia Papa Nicola
Lubitza N. Pipercu
Paraschevia S. Percea
Anastasia L. Simcea
Santa S. Simcea
Fania G. Save
Hariclia N. Tone
Victoria T. Tovar
Constantina N. Tapu
Hariclia S. Tapu
Hariclia V. Mufa
Zaharia T. Buseicu
Anastasia C. Cusca
Domnica S. Mitri
Victoria C. Paligora
Caonstantina N. Romce
Domnica T. Terpu
Paraschevia H. Velciu
Fania G. Velciu
Hariclia T. Leascu
Constantina N. Vulcani
Domnica S. Buseicu
Domnica T. Nerti
Athina N. Nace
Vasilichia I. Olde
Domnica C. Paligora
Domnica N. Topa
Domnica I. Olde

The eighth Romanian girls school established:
Location: Magarova today FYR Macedonia
Year of founding: 1882 February
Name of the teachers: Olimpia Paraschide
Number of pupils year 1889-90: 21

Sia Caramina
Fanca Steriu
Vasilichia C. Samara
Leanca Nachi
Falia Cociu
Tomaita G. Anghelina
Fania Gaichi
Maria Gheorghe
Vasilichia Chiria
Nusca Chiria
Crivita Tale
Vasilichia U. Tale
Polixene Nicola
Nusca D. Docu
Zoita G. Lice
Parusca Pangu
Maria I. Zica
Elena Dafin
Elena Stoia
Fania Eftimescu
Elena N. Ciapanu

Cocia Dimitrescu

Post Scriptum:

This -by no means exhaustive list- reflects the educational landscape of the Romanian schools of Macedonia, Epirus and Albania at 1890. In the years to follow, the number of primary schools, gymnasiums and Lycees increased substantially. The so called "clash between Hellenism and Latinism" of which D. J. Hogarth was writing became quite manifest in the educational field. The combined efforts of the Greek clergy and establishment to forcibly Grecisize, or "Hellenize" the Vlachs were doomed to failure (see letter Sir Arthur Evans).
Some Vlachs, nevertheless, exposed pro-Greek sympathies, thus gaining the pejorative nick-name of Grekomani or Katsaoni. Their penchant for Greek language education had to do, pragmatically, with economic interest and pressure from the Greek clergy. Many Greek priests would go so far and refusing to burry deceased Aromanian infants if they attended Romanin school (see concrete case described by Theodor Capidan to Hugh Setton-Wattson at Salonica in 1909 and included by the English historian in his volume of collected letters). As Theodore Burada, who compiled the above list points out, it was the Aromanian woman who bravely kept alive the Vlach language. And we can not refrain from noticing how numerous were the Aromanian girls' schools at a time when very few girls, in Greece itself had any sort of access to education. In fact, in Greece, the status of the woman was so low that this was the last country in Europe to give right of vote to women, as late as 1953 (see Richard Clogg - A Concise History of Greece, Cambridge University Press 1993).
After the Aromanians were recognized as a separate Vlach millet in 1906, their status had improved further. An Aromanian former pupil present on the lists above (Nicolae Batzaria) became later Member of the Constantinople Parliament and for a while Government Minister, representing his people. After the attachment of Macedonia to the Serbian Kingdom respectively to Greece in 1913, the Serbian authorities closed on the spot the Romanian school (including the famous Lycee of Bitola). The Greeks on the other side , allowed the further functioning of these schools (including that of the Lyceum of Ioannina and of the Romanian Commercial College of Salonica) until 1944. This was possible due to a special agreement between the Greek Prime Minister Venizelos and the Romanian Government when parts of Macedonia were given to Greece at Bucharest in 1913. Some Romanian churches and schools continued to function clandestinely and it was as late as 1952 that Costa Bacou, the Vlach priest of Gramaticuva (Anno Grammatikon) was still reading the liturgy in Aromanian. Afterwards, he was not allowed by the Greek authorities to officiate the divine service in Aromanian, while he refused to forcibly switch to Greek language (source: G. Padioti - Prologue to Cantici Farserotesti, 1990).
The closure of the Romanian schools was also the effect of the axing in 1948 (by the Stalinist Foreign Secretary of Romania, Ana Pauker), of the Direction for Macedonia of the Romanian Education Ministry. The director of this department was an Aromanian, Augustin Calianu, who was also sacked with this occasion. Another Aromanian, Iuliu Valaori occupied earlier the top position of Education Minister, while in 1860's it was another personality of Aromanian origin, Spiru Haret who was the founder of the modern pedagogy and a celebrated Government minister himself in Bucharest. His statue still adorns the University Square of Bucharest. In 1990, Marian Papahagi (of the famous Avdela clan Papahagi) whose great-uncles can be seen in the list above, occupied briefly the position of Education State Secretary in Bucharest. Since 1996, the Culture Minister of Romania is Ion Caramitru, recently awarded by the Queen Elizabeth II the title of OBE, whose grandfather attended the Romanian Lyceum in Bitola and can be traced in the above list as well. His wife, Michaela Caracas has also Vlach origin, one of her forefathers, a celebrated doctor setteled in Bucharest in the 18th century belonging to a family originating in the Macedonian town of Seatiste.

A list with names of villages and towns inhabited exclusively or in majority by Aromanians, as presented by Theodor Burada to the Royal Roumanian Society of Geography on May 27th, 1902:

Macedonia, Epirus and Albania:

Aminciu (Metsovo)
Avdela - Avela
Baiasa (Vouvoussa)
Beala di ngios
Beala di supra
Berviciani (Berivoi)
Bitolia (Monastir)
Calive de Balcani (ninga raul Metsovo)
Calive Istoc
Calive Jarcan
Calive de Ianita
Calive de Murihova
Calive de Sudena
Calive de Veria
Calive de Vodena
Chiare (Anilio)
Costarca di sus
Costarca di ngios
Dimcea (Dimitzas)
Floru - Flamburaru
Giumaia (Djumaia)
Gramoticova (Anno Gramatikon)
Hrupistea (Argos Orestikon)
Huni (Houni)
Laca (Laitza)
Lumini (Limini)
Lupei (Liupei)
Megidei - Midzidei (Kefalovrissi)
Pazi (Pades)
Roscani (Rogani)
Sanmaria (Samarina)
Securi (Tsekouri)
Seracu (Sirakou)
Seriani Furca
Spancea (Spanitsa)
Surin (Prosilio)
Susui (Sousoli - Zouzouli)
Sudena di ngios
Sudena di supra
Turia (Crania)
Vitsa di supra
Vitsa di ngios
Vogoriani - Vurgariani
Vranistea - Branistea
Vurgarei (Voulgareli)

in Thessaly:

Alimeri (Pelion)
Ameru (Paliomela)
Costeana (Kastania)
Muciara (Athamania)
Mures (Mouressi - Pelion)
Orghili (Filoseli)
Pergnacu di ngios
Pergnacu di supra
Pertuli di ngios
Pertuli di sus
Sesclu (Sesklo)
Turda - Coturi

in the district of Valona (Avlona), Albania:

Levani Samari
Levani Feta
Stan Carbunara

in the district of Musachia and Durazzo, Albania:

Ferica mari
Ferica mica
Petre Duar

Names of mountains, gorges, rivers:

Valea Calda ("Valea Kalda")
Giumerca (Tzoumerka)
Varful cu brad
Chiatra umbroasa
Muscelu ("Mitskeli", "Mitskeli")

Sources: La Turquie d'Europe de Ami Boue Paris, 1840 Tom. II. p.22
Kanitz - Conference ethnographiques tenues dans le seance de la societe geographique de Vienne la 24 Fevrier 1863.



lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:33 PM (GMT)
3. "RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod"

Vaka e polesno, neli, trebase vaka da postiram, se izvinuvam....

kade bile tie skoli po mojot Ohrid, bas me interesira, i taka daeni so ime prezime i ucenici, i predavaci....kolku interesno, a vo mojot grad nema nikakov trag od takvo skolo, ili zgrada na koja pisuva, ovde imase VLASKO SKOLO...
Cudno neli?
I na forumov , nikoj ne pisuva za vlasite, cudno??!!
Sekoj ja izbegava temata. Zosto?!
Dali ima nekoj vlav na forumov, da napise troa za svojot rod i za svoja istorija, ako nema togas ke pisuvam jas.....


lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:36 PM (GMT)
4. "RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod"
The fifth established Romanian school:
Location: Ochrida (today FYR Macedonia)
Year of founding: 1868
type: boys school
Teachers: G. Tomara, Gheorge Pihion, Filip Apostolescu, Ioan Zgala
Numbers of pupils as registered in year 1889-90: 55
Names of the pupils year 1889-90:

Achilea Dafina
Costi Busaca
Constantin Bumba
Dule Gepar
Gheorghe Chita
Mihali Joma
Mihali Stefanescu
Mihali Ionescu
Miha Ioan
Mitra Tamina
Nacu Deala
Pandi Miha
Pitu Sambitel
Spiru Joma
Sotir Ionescu
Tachi Busaca
Tascu Atanasescu
Tascu Stoe
Vangeliu Poa
Zisu Parmachi
Anton Petrescu
Bana Tamina
Iancu Baliuc
Ilia Pitosu
Mihali Ianecu
Niculae Ghiscu
Nicolae Murghila
Nicolae Constantinescu
Naum Atanasescu
Stefan Ghergu
Spiru Niculescu
Tomu Chiohi
Tachi Ionescu
Nicolae Ianescu
Zizi Sacarecu
Alexandru Gerah
Aureliu Goju
Gavriil Petrescu
Leon Papa Stefan
Naum Anastasescu
Pascu Veroniu
Spiru Dimonia
Spiru Baliuc
Tascu Ruvina
Tascu Arsen
Vangeliu Gepar
Atatasie Rusaca
Andrea Pihion
Stavri Bija
Tascu Goju
Vasilie Sacu
Dimitrie Naumescu
Dimitrie Verusu
Gregoriu Veroniu
Virgiliu Apostolescu


lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:38 PM (GMT)
5. "RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod"
The first Romanian Girls school established:
Location: Ochrida today FYR Macedonia
Year of founding: 1879, January
Type of school: Girls
Teachers: Agatia Apostolescu, Fani Petru
Numbers of pupils year 1889-90: 20
Names of the girls year 1889-90:

Anastasia Biba
Calina Verus
Lenca Gerahu
Lenca Veroniu
Marita Apostolescu
Marita Traice
Nusca Dimonie
Nusca Dafa
Nusca Stoe
Polixenia Scuretta
Polixenia Veroniu
Clio Tote
Morfa Dimonie
Marita Coe
Marita Picina
Sandra Pendu
Vasa Nestoru
Victoria Veroniu
Calina Roca
Zaha Coe


lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:44 PM (GMT)
6. "RE: Vlasite vo Ohrid"
Gi izdvoiv samo dvete skoli vo Ohrid, no istoto vazi i za drugite.

Kade se ovie skoli?!
Kade se ovie luge i nivnite potomci?!
Dali deneska se osekjaat(cuvstvuvaat) kako turci, albanci, makedonci, bugari, grci ili gjupci.....?!
Najverovatno se pisuvaat Makedonci--i ne se cuvstvuvaat nimalku bugari, iako eden od studentite ima moe prezime a jas sum Albanec, ha ha ha , kakva zavrzlama Balkanska.
Kade se nivnite crkvi i grobista?!

Daj vklucete se i vie vo temava ako vi e interesna, no ve molam ne so glupi paroli od tipot" da zivee rusija" koga nemame nikakov muabet da kazeme i drugi detinjasti gluparii....

pershedetje te perzemerta
lupus ilirikus


lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:52 PM (GMT)
7. "RE: Vlasite nasi sosedi";jsessionid=4b1jk185q1dpe?method=4&dsid=2222&dekey=Vlachs&gwp=8&curtab=2222_1&sbid=lc04a

lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 05:54 PM (GMT)
8. "RE: Vlasite nasi sosedi"

Kain Click to EMail KainClick to check IP address of the poster 05-Mar-05, 07:00 PM (GMT)
10. "RE: Vlasite vo Ohrid"
> iako eden
>od studentite ima moe prezime
>a jas sum Albanec, ha
>ha ha , kakva zavrzlama

Kojznae, mozhebi i ti si so Vlasko poteklo! (kako i golem del od albanskiot politicki vrv)


ABC Click to EMail ABCClick to check IP address of the poster 06-Mar-05, 05:01 AM (GMT)
11. "Vlasite se``gazdi``vo Makedonija!"
Najpovrzani so evreite se vlasite koj se glavni gazdi vo Makedonija.Pocnuvajki od Hari Kostov,pa do Vanja Bitoljanu,do Boris Kondarko ili Jani Makraduli se vlav do vlav,ako go zememe vo predvid i somnitelniot evrein Andrej Zelinovski,site tie na nekoj nacin ja predstavuvaat biznis elitata,koja se zanimava so visokohonorarna politika,bez pri toa da imaat eden den politicka naobrazba.Znaci tie se ufrleni od nekogo vo Makedonskiot politicki vrv so cel da ja kleknat Makedonija na kolena.Mozebi ke uspeat vo toa,no iako molcat imajte vo predvid deka tie se onoj izbran narod koj rakovodat so se shto se vika kapital vo Makedonija.Ako navidum se cini deka vlasite se izgubija,tie se tuka otsekogash povrzani so Albancite kako bi ja podelile drzavava.Megutoa vremeto ke pokaze dali ke uspeat vo toa.

dijasporec Click to EMail dijasporecClick to check IP address of the poster 06-Mar-05, 06:55 AM (GMT)
12. "Me zacuduva"

Pasivnosta, so ne aktivnost na forumov, od strana na vlasite a pogotovo od evreite, me zacuduva. I ednite i drugite imale i imaat dinamicna istorija, narocito ovie so holokaustot. Jas bi sakal da znam na primer kako tie denes mizeruvaat mozebi povejke od sekogas. Toa mozda e taka tamu vo Makedonija a ovde vo zapadot ne e bas taka. Ako ne e bas taka, togas zosto e taka, da ne e taka za da izgleda taka???.



Kain Click to EMail KainClick to check IP address of the poster 06-Mar-05, 01:02 PM (GMT)
13. "RE: Vlasite se``gazdi``vo Makedonija!"
Koga vlasite gineja za vreme na Ilindenskoto vostanije i vo NOB, dali gineja za da ja "kleknat Makedonija"? Znaes kade izbegaa Ilindenskite "geroi" poslem vostanijeto, i cii kuki beja plackani i zapaleni vo Krusevo? Koj ostana do posledno da se borit za svojata sloboda? Ima dobri luge i loshi luge - i megu dobrite i megu loshite ima individi so vlasko poteklo. No nivniot karakter nema vrska so nekakvo 'vlahstvo'.

ABC Click to EMail ABCClick to check IP address of the poster 06-Mar-05, 01:28 PM (GMT)
14. "RE: Vlasite se``gazdi``vo Makedonija!"
Neosporen e faktot deka vlasite ``ginea``za Makedonija,no isto taka neosporen e faktot deka denes vlasite se visoka biznis elita koja im sluzi na Bugarskite i Albanskite hegemonisticki interesi.Ako nekoj misli deka Makedoncite ne ginea za Makedonija togash gadno se zaebal.Sepak od tolku maliot procent na naselenie,a tolku golemata prisutnost vo korupciskite Makedonski biznisi,site nas ne naveduva na faktot deka vlasite rakovodat so shirokite narodni masi na Makedonija!

Kain Click to EMail KainClick to check IP address of the poster 06-Mar-05, 01:41 PM (GMT)
15. "Stvarno?"
A komu mu sluzhit elitata na LjuBBBBBBBBcho so Ljambe, Vojo i Co? I site drugi aramii i lazgovci sto ne se so vlasko poteklo a e unistuvaa i unistuvaat Makedonija? Dzgan si e dzgan.

lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 06-Mar-05, 02:48 PM (GMT)
16. "RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!"
Kako be Kain taka,nema vrska so "vlahstvo".

Ako si vlav, se sto pravis ima vrska so vlahstvo. Kako na primer, ti so tvojot post(posledniot)gi odbrani vlasite od "napadot" za nekakvo "konspirativno vlasko vladeenje", a so postot od vcera so koj mi odgovori mene, e kako ona---od polna vreka p...i, da se fatis za k.r

Moite postovi se so cel da se podiskutira malku za toj starosedelski narod na balkanot, za da sme poblizu do "istoriskata vistina" koja ke ostane sekogas relativna.
Gledate deka vo eden Balkan kade oci se kornat za da se dokaze koj e sto, ima i takvi koi se obratni vo tie cuvstva...kako VLASITE(golem broj od niv).

Tie se deklariraat kako mnozinskiot narod vo Balkanskite drzavi vo koi ziveat, a na granicnite predeli, se se i sesto--vistinska KASA-CORBA od deklariranje, edniot e MAKEDONEC-drugiot GRK-tretiot ALBANEC-cetvrtiot BUGARIN --SRBIN....itn.itn, a vo stvarnost(u stvari)site se


jas si imam(kako i sekoj od nas) svoe razmisluvanje za toa sto se i koi se VLASITE, mislenje potkrepeno na licni iskustva i dosega procitani materijali.

Toa se romanizirani(od rimjanite) Balkanski starosedelci.

Dali se toa romanizirani Iliri, romanizirani Trakijci, Epiroti, anticki Makedonci,Grci-a mozebi i grupi na Kelti(naseleni od strana na rimjanite ili pak drugi narodi od golemoto Rimsko Cesarstvo-carstvo).....zavisi za koj geografski predeli zboruvame.

Ako na ova se dodade i slavjaniziranjeto-so doaganje na SLAVJANITE na Balkanot, "boite" i natamu se mesaat vo komplicirano "vinozito".

Tie romanizirani-rimjanizirani balkanski starosedelci kade sto se srbite-stanuvaat srbi, kade sto se albanci-albanci, kade sto se grcite-grci, kade sto se bugarite-bugari, kade sto se makedonci-makedonci.

Koga na ovaa CORBA BALKANSKA ke dodademe i neophodnite sostojki koisto falat-a toa se tie na rumunskiot narod,ili rumunskite vlasi, i nivnata vrska so Rumunite i Rumunija(staro narecena VLASKO), koi se potomci na romanizirani trako-dakijci, nasata Vlaska balkanska corba stanuva uste pobogata.

I nakraj koga ke se potsetime deka vlasite se(bile) so pastoralna nomadska(vo pogolemiot del)karakteristika, preselbi i dvizenja po balkanskite predeli, uste poveke ja izmesa i iskomplicira ovaa slika.

Sega, vo prodolzenie, ufff........od komplicirano po komplicirano(zatoa e i interesno), evrejite koi se dvizea po balkanskite platoa i planini, se srekavaa edni so drugi i se pretopuvaa edni vo drugi, asimiliraa edni vo drugi........

Po religija tie se skoro najcesto pravoslavni no so LATINSKO pismo, gi ima i katolici i muslimani, a kako sto rekovme pogore i evreji...

Za da se usredotocime vo Makedonija, ke treba da vidime malku poblisko sto se slucuvalo vo bliskoto minato vo nasite predeli.

Postovite koisto gi postirav vcera bea samo za da obrnam vnimanie na toa kolku e interesno-balkanski kompliciran "problemot", i deka so nego se zanimavaat stranski naucnici veke podolgo vreme i site onie koi se zanimavaat so Balkanot, na eden ili drug nacin.

Vlasite gi imalo vo najgolem broj okolu planinata PIND, a blizu do denesna Makedonija, eden od nivnite najgolemi centri bila VOSKOPOJA ili MOSKOPOLE, denesno selo nad KORCA.

Ubavinite na Voskopoja-Moskopole bile nadaleku cueno vosvoe vreme.
Kuluturen i religiozen centar na Vlasite(mal del na naselenieto bile albanci), imal so bezbroj manastiri i crkvi, pozlateni ikonostasi, golem broj na privatni skoli, i na intelektualci koi zboruvale na poveke stranski jazici, kade sto se istaknuval francuskiot, i so nivnoto znaenje i uka i nacin na zivot i oblekuvanje, vlasite od Voskopoja daleku prednjacele pred drugite gradovi i drugite Balkanski narodi vo nivnoto opkruzuvanje.

Za zal ovoj "biser" na nasite predeli e zapalen dvapati, vo kombinacija na grcko-fanariotska ljubomora i tursko-albanska glupost.

Tuka se i pocetocite na sozdavanjeto na trijazicnite recnici vlasko-grcko-albanski, kako potrebni orudija kupeni i naracani od fanariotite za asimilacija na vlasite i albancite. Za nivna fanariotska zalost, istite recnici se upotrebija za obratnoto, ucenje na albanskiot jazik i potreba na sozdavanje na albanskoto pismo, so pomos na Naum Vecilharxhi, Konstantin Kristoforidhi...........

Intelektualno sklonite vlasi od Voskopoja, se preselija vo Korca , Tirana, Ohrid,Resen, Struga, Bitola,Krusevo, Skopje, ....i im se priklucija na nivnite rodnini koi veke ziveeja voovie pomali ili pogolemi gradovi.....

So sigurnost mozam da tvrdam edno, deka sekoj eden koisto e vlav po poteklo(po dvata ili eden od roditelite), sigurno ne se cuvstvuva BUGARIN, i ne saka da se asocira so BUGARIZMOT ili BUGARASTVO, no treba da znaeme i da sme jasni deka ako tie sakaat da se makedonci(posto ziveat vo makedonija tie se makedonci vo geografska konotacija), nivniot jazik e vlaski, ako zboruvaat slavjanski, togas toj jazik nema nikakva vrska so antickiot makedonski, tuku ima vrska so bugarskiot slavjanski jazik, i so drugite slavjanski jazici.
Ova izgleda komplicirano no za upateno "oko" ednostavno objasnuvanje na toa sto e vidlivo so golo "oko", i stanuva komplicirano samo koga treba da se zboruva i objasnuva za nesto sto e OCIGLEDNO.

Koja mi e celta na mojot post?!", (treba da se ima cel koga se postira, ne samo da se tropa na teneke)

Kako i sekogas , jas imam cel da pokazam i dokazam deka site zavrzlami balkanski se mnogu interesni i simpaticni ako se gledaat so takvi oci.
Sekoj jazik i kultura imaat svoja boja i ubavina vo nasiot Balkanski kolorit.

Beganje od golata vistina e samo oteznuvanje i uste poveke kompliciranje na i taka kompliciranata istorija vo celina i Balkanot vo posebnost.

Faktite treba da se pregrnat so NAUCNA toplina i dobredojdenost, ne so cinizam, nihilizam i podsmev.

Vlasite kako eden od najflagrantnite primeri na toa sto znaci da si Balkanec, potvrduvaat niz sto sve pomina ovaa podnebje.
Nekoj moze da gi gleda kako konspiratori i saboteri vo doticnite drzavi, i nemaat malku argumenti za toa.

Vlasite sigurno si pomagaat sebesi koga ke se vo intima eden so drug, no jas bi rekol tokmu zaradi toa sto se sekade na Balkanov i na celni pozicii, treba da go smirat i da go povedat vo nova ponapredna idnina.

Jas sakav mnogu odamna da pomuabetime za VLASITE, no nikoj ne odgovarase, ili mnogumina od vas se VLASI, ili ne znaete za problemot NISTO.

Za mene licno koga eden slavjanski bugarin se obiduva da mu dokaze na eden slavjanski makedonec deka imaat dopirni tocki i slicna zaednicka istorija i kultura i jazik, a ovoj se buni i ne saka da prifati i poveruva na fakti od koi OCI BOLAT i USI PUKAAT, ima samo eden logicen odgovor, makedonskiot slavjanin ne e SLAVJANIN, tuku e VLAV, kakov sto bil i ....naprimer... Jane Sandanski------VLAV.

Relaksiranje na vasite nacionalni cuvstva ke donese doblest za site.

Bidete makedonci ako sakate, rekov veke porano i na toa stojam, no poistovetuvanje so antickiot makedonski jazik, e istoriska-kulturna-politicka NEBULOZNOST ili podirektno kazano GLUPOST NAD SEKAKVA GLUPOST.

Gledanje i citanje na faktite vo Balkanot, studija na site narodi i nivni jazici i kulturi, ke gi napravi site vazni i dobredojdeni i priznati, vo svojata posebnost.....

Vie koi ste vlasi na forumov, prasajte se sebesi zosto se sramite od toa sto ste VLASI.Deka eden od vasite roditeli e VLAV?!

Kain prijatele, na ova odgovorimi iskreno, a za toa dali sum jas Vlav?, mislev sigurno deka ne sum, no koga go vidov moeto(staro) prezime kaj eden od Ohridskite studenti, mnogu se zaintrigirav iskreno receno, i toa go napisav i pak go pisuvam, iako treba da nadopolnam deka so takvi preziminja imam sretnato vo Albanija i Katolici i pravoslavni i muslimani i site velat deka se potomci od poznatite Ohridski Znaminja(za vreme tursko).
Jas ke se interesiram i ponatamu da najdam informacii za tie ohridski vlaski skoli, i za studentite i za toj so moeto prezime, i ako sum jas vlav ili toj albanec, se isto ke go prifatam kako uste edna Balkanska prikaska.

Edno direktno prasanje Kain, dali si ti VLAV?!
Dali poznavas nekoj Vlav?
Sto mislis za vlasite?!i napisi malu poveke od dva reda, izmaci si go mozokot malku intelektualen, zatoa sto ete ...mene me interesira.

pershendetje te perzemerta
lupus ilirikus


gropaj Click to EMail gropajClick to check IP address of the poster 06-Mar-05, 07:44 PM (GMT)
17. "RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!"
ako si zainteresiran za vllasite kaj nas i vo regionot, probaj ovdeka:

a ako si pak zainteresiran za celiot region, eve:


ABC Click to EMail ABCClick to check IP address of the poster 07-Mar-05, 02:30 AM (GMT)
18. "RE: Vlasite se SE vo Makedonija!"
Tocni podatoci nema shto megutoa zacuduva faktot shto site vlasi,se na rakovodni funkcii i prestizni direktorski mesta vo ogromen broj na firmi vo Makedonija,iako se samo 1-2% od Makedonskoto naselenie.
-Ili se premnogu intelegentni ili nekoj gi``turka``na takvi mesta vo posledno vreme!
Po se ova ke da e ova vtoroto,veruvajte deka ne moze da bidat tolku intelegentni i intelektualno nadogradeni pa da bidat stvoreni da go vodat bankarskiot,osiguritelniot ili avio-biznisot vo Makedonija ucestvuvajki na najexponiranite politicki funkcii vo drzavniot aparat.Za vreme na VMRO isto taka vlasite bea vo samiot vrv na drzavata i tie upravuvaa so minimalno politicki educiranata vlast na celo so LuBco,koj beshe tolku alcen shto podpadna pod celosna vlashka kontrola samo za da prigrabi poveke pari!

lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 07-Mar-05, 04:16 PM (GMT)
19. "RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!"
Blagodaram mnogu za postot (andrea) gropaj.

Izgleda na drugite ne im e mnogu interesno da porazgovaraat malku za Vlasite, toj mnogu star i interesen etnikum na nasiot sareno-iskompliciran Balkan.

Toa sto bi trebalo da ne zasega e situacijata a Balkanov, koja e predizvikana od porasnatiot nacionalizam i sovinizam, vo site balkanski krugovi, kade vo sekoj odvoeno se tvrdi deka ---------NIE sme podobri od VAS....

Nie site sme dobri i losi,uspesni i neuspesni vo nasiot zivoten maraton, zavisno od toa kolku imame sreka i pogodni okolknosti vo zivotot.

So novite promeni vo Makedonija, se stvoreni pravni uslovi za poravnopraven pocetok na zivotniot maraton....

Vo svoeto prepelkanje i uporno tvrdenje na apsurdna i nebulozna istorija "makedonecot", ke vergla vo besvest i ke bide precka za napredok na Makedonija kako drzava.

Zaostanatosta i celosnata emancipacija na albanecot vo Makedonija e istotaka edna momentalna precka vo razvojot na Makedonija vo evropsko-svetskite moderni tekovi.

Dodeka albanecot so pomos na svojata sopstvena zelba i zed za emancipacija i brzi promeni vo opsestveniot razvoj, so pomos na institucii(universitet, TV, sportski ustanovi,zgolemeni kontakti so drugi albanski-i nealbanski evropski porazvieni sredini), ke se smeni, prasanje e sto i do kade ke ne odnese "makedonskata" nebuloza i inaet magareski.



ABC Click to EMail ABCClick to check IP address of the poster 11-Mar-05, 01:24 AM (GMT)
20. "RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!"
Kade se tuka:
-trgovija i shverc so ``beli robje``?
-trgovija i shverc so ``narkoticni supstanci``
-trgovija i shverc so ``oruzje i rasprsnuvacki materii``
-trgovija i shverc so ``cigari na Bit Pazar``
-trgovija i ilegalna prodazba na``drzavno zemjishte``?
Ili seto ova e nebitno vo trkata za pobrza integracija vo ``sovremenite tekovi``?
Abe ti mora da si nekoj ``MORON``shtom kazuvash samo pozitivni raboti kako:TV,univerzitet,biznis kontakti,pro-edukativni raboti,pri toa zanemaruvajki gi negativnite konsekvenci i realnosta koja na nekoj nacin e sogledliva i od avion pa i vrapcite ja znaat.Za kazna ke te nosime kaj nekoj novopecen student po stomatologija da ti gi poprava zabite.

lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 12-Mar-05, 00:40 AM (GMT)
21. "RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!"
>Kade se tuka:
>-trgovija i shverc so ``beli robje``?
>-trgovija i shverc so ``narkoticni supstanci``
>-trgovija i shverc so ``oruzje i
>rasprsnuvacki materii``
>-trgovija i shverc so ``cigari na
>Bit Pazar``
>-trgovija i ilegalna prodazba na``drzavno zemjishte``?
>Ili seto ova e nebitno vo
>trkata za pobrza integracija vo
>``sovremenite tekovi``?

Kako mislis, kade se TUKA............

Mislis zosto vo mojot pogoren post ne gi imam spomnato ovie raboti???!!!???

Mozebi zatoa sto ne mi bil tuka muabetot, ne zatoa sto ne sum gi spomnal porano.
Sum rekol i pak ke recam deka kriminalnite aktivnosti se kriminalni aktivnosti, ako zboruvame za albanskite kriminalni aktivnosti se KRIMINALNO golemi i zagrizuvacki, i jas od toa se sramam i se ograduvam i go osuduvam, no ne znaci deka ne go razbiram, i ne sakam da ja smenam slikata vo IDNINA.

>Abe ti mora da si nekoj
>``MORON``shtom kazuvash samo pozitivni raboti
>kako:TV,univerzitet,biznis kontakti,pro-edukativni raboti,

Da, jas sum MORON, zatoa i gi naglasiv gornite raboti koi ti gi povtoruvas, i ete jas pak ke gi povtoram(posto sum MORON).

Da, so tie TV programi, universitet, pro-edukativni raboti,nie albancite ke se samokritikuvame tamu kade sto treba(KRIMINALITET---DROGA___PROSTITUCIJA), i ke se falime tamu kade sto treba (JAZIK-KULTURA, moralni vrednosti od nasata istorija, covecki opsti svetski pridobivki) i drugi ti rekov mi rece rabosce.....
za da se katalizira(zabrza) nasata celosna emancipacija za edna napredna evropska idnina,potkrepeno i nadgradeno na seto pozitivno od naseto albansko kulturno istorisko bogatstvo.


Ova si go napisal za toa sto ne sum go spomnal, vo mojot post,
A STO IMAS da kazes za toa sto go spomnav....???!!??

Za tvoite INTELIGENTNI rajko-zajko odgovori???!!??

Gledam podolu vo drugite postovi tvojata "Makedonska" INTELIGENCIJA cveta, od karpatite prihajali pozadi odzadi preku KICEVO....e vi nema raven zimi sve,,, alal da vi e..

Ti blagodaram sto go spomna ovaa karakteristicno glupo istorisko akrobatsko slavomakedonsko tolkuvanje, go imav slusnato i procitano vo nekoe glupo spisanie pred desettina godini, i ako go kazev jas ovde ne ke mi poveruvaa.....

Sto ste PRIHAJALI vo toj mozok imbecilen falsfikatorsko glupi, ti i site tvoi "svetski priznati" istoricari, koi mirisaat na pivo rakija i prski, i ne znaat kade im se opincite, a kamoli koj i koga se PRIHAJALI od ovaa ili onaa strana na svetite vi KARPATSKI PLANINI.

Jas sum MORON,site srbi i hrvati bile MORONI, grcite MORONI,bulgarite MORONI, i site svetski istoricari bile MORONI, tvoite akrobati pivo-prski-rakija istoricari bile pametnite....

Koga ke procitam vakvi NEBULOZI,nemam zborovi na kakva intelektualna macnina mi sozdavaat vakvi GLUPI detinjasti iskrivokolceni naucno zlobni tvrdenja, za da se opravda druga NEBULOZA, i taka biser do biser, gerdan od NEBULOZI, i GLUPOST do GLUPOST.....Da go ispovratis mozokot niz usi....

....sram da vi e.....

Ravno 100 (citaj stotina) godini im trebase na slavjanite da pominat preku Dunav..........
i samo za ovie stotina godini se pisuvalo mnogu-napretek za niv i za nivnoto divjastvo....

smesno i zalosno......

Ete prijatele, ti sam go potvrduvas mojot strav...
Strav deka i natamu ke bidam svedok na magarinja koi so glup inaet, ke rikaat so vakvi GLUPOSTI, iako da bidam iskren porano mi smetase poveke, a vo idnina ke se obidam da se naviknam, i da pocnam da uzivam vo akrobatskoto tolkuvanje na istorijata, samo ke pazam da ne se usmrdam od zdivot zasmrden od pivo-prski i rakija.....

sram da vi e .........intelektualno mislam....SRAM DA VIE.....kakvi gluposti...neka vi e GOSPOD na pomos i vas i nas, od vakvi gluposti....

PRIHAJALI....ha ha ha...Gospod da cuvat i da branit......sramota...nemam drug zbor......

Sakav da postiram... no uste nesto...

Kako velis ti?,ako nekoj tvrdi poinaku neka poveli neka diskutira na forumov otvoren e ???!!

Me potseka na onaa narodnata:
Frlil eden budala kamen vo voda, i ne mozele....

Budaliot e prsko-pivsko-rakijskiot akrobatski istoricar so navedeniot glup istoriski nebulozen postulat, ti blagodaram sto go spomna ovde,i mi pomogna mene i na site drugi da svatat kakvi GLUPOSTI tvrdat i pisuvaat "makedonistite" .....intelektualen kriminalitet i sramota....


ABC Click to EMail ABCClick to check IP address of the poster 12-Mar-05, 02:19 AM (GMT)
22. "RE: Vlasite SE vo Makedonija!"
E,aj sega koga zapocnavme,pa neli forumot e otvoren za site?Znaci edukacijata na Albancite vo Makedonija ja gledash vo organiziranje na srednoshkolcite vo Debar ``zestoko``da demonstriraat za sproveduvanjeto na Kosmetarot Ramush Haradinaj vo Hag?Edukacijata na Albancite preku javnite mediumi ja gledash vo borbrnite izjavi od tipot:-Pobedivme vo 2001,pobedivme vo Tetovo,Gostivar,Debar,Struga,ke pobedime vo Kicevo,a sega ke gi pobedime Makedoncite nasekade kade shto treba!Toa e za tebe educiranje?Takov li s-ramkoven dogovor potpishaa nashite lideri``drmoserci``?Vo shto gi pobedivte Makedoncite za prv pat vo istorijata?Vo finansiranje na MZ i EU so vashite narko-dilerski fondovi?Mislite li deka ste dovolno jaki da izlezete vo otvoreni bitki?Mislite li deka titulata doktor se dobiva samo ako si bil clen na ONA,dali ke vrdi ne e vazno neli?

iva Click to EMail ivaClick to check IP address of the poster 06-Jun-05, 11:04 AM (GMT)
23. "RE: Vlasi-zaboraven narod"
Dobar den,

dali bi imale zelba volonterski da ucestvuvate na eden proekt, istarzuvanje na 50 isti ili slicni idiomi vo site evetski jazici, vo ramkite na EUROPHRAS, evropsko drustvo za frazeologija.
Ako ne vie, togas mozete li da posocite nekogo?

Iva Fidanceva


lupus Click to EMail lupusClick to check IP address of the poster 07-Jun-05, 06:45 PM (GMT)
25. "RE: za IVA"
>Dobar den,
>dali bi imale zelba volonterski da
>ucestvuvate na eden proekt, istarzuvanje
>na 50 isti ili slicni
>idiomi vo site evetski jazici,
>vo ramkite na EUROPHRAS, evropsko
>drustvo za frazeologija.
>Ako ne vie, togas mozete li
>da posocite nekogo?
>Iva Fidanceva

Dal Bog dobro 'iva'.

Dali gorniot post i ponuda se odnesuva na mene?!?

Bi bil pocesten(ako e upatena kon mene) so ponudata koja e ...da recam...ljubopitnoskokotliva i grgolesrazbuduvacka.....i za koja bi sakal se razbira poveke informacija...

Me respekt dhe falemnderime te vecanta,

lupus ilirikus



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